holding striking surfaces

[Magpie Saegar]

this sort of fits on this board......

i asked about holding the striking surface of YOUR OWN weapon.

here is the answer:
www.belegarth.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=10912

i wrote:

hey, i was hoping to get some clarification on something that came up in a thread here and in my practice.

are you allowed to hold the striking surface of your own weapon? this would be for halfswording.

i BELIEVE the only rule on it is BoW wrote:
3.7.5. Gripping the striking surface of an opponents Weapon results in the disabling of that limb.


and, if you are allowed to do so: if the hand on the blade is struck does it count 'as part of that weapon' and take no damage?

freyson replied:

Are you allowed to hold the striking surface of your OWN weapons?

YES!

3.7.5. Gripping the striking surface of an opponents Weapon results in the disabling of that limb.

This is the rule. There is no rule about what you cannot do to your own weapon.

3.1.5. Hand(s) – Area below the wrist (exclusive). An empty Hand is a legal Target Area. A Hand on a Weapon is considered part of that Weapon.

The hand would not take any damage if hit since it is on the weapon and considered part of that weapon.

This must be ACTIVE blocking and griping. It is the difference between what you are doing to (gripping) a weapon and what you are doing with (laying) a weapon. If you are just laying the weapon across the hand it would fall under this rule:

3.7.3. Blocking a Weapon strike by laying a Weapon against a Target Area and/or Shield is illegal.

thats sounds weird to say that you can't block with your hand supporting your blade but you can when holding it. perhaps someone else will respond there. what do others think?

[Rae]

My interpretation of this is that you can't use the sword to purposefully defend your hand/arm.
Example:
resuting in loss of arm: An attacker makes a downward swing at your free hand when your weapon is lowered...there is no time to fully raise your own weapon above your open hand, but you move fast enough to get contact with your weapon before they make contact.
not loss of arm: An attacker makes a downward swing and you have enough time to grasp your weapon and hold it up in a solid block.

I think the rule of laying of a weapon on a target area was originally focused on forbidding using weapons as unbreakable armor. Freyson got through to the point it would be almost the same thing if you used your own blade to make your other hand invulnerable to attacks(outside normal weapon wielding).

If you were to start practicing with blocks, it would probably be best to hold the flat of the blade. What is halfswording?

[Magpie Saegar]

halfswording would be, as i would like to use it, holding the sword as normal with one hand (on the handle) while the other hand grabs the blade (flats and striking surfaces.. hand goes around the blade).

from this position, one can raise the sword in the air horizontally to block downward strikes.. which would not be terribly effective in belegarth where there are no headshots... but one can also do many other things, such as stab with much more control and accuracy.

it would never really be used other than occasionally with red/green swords, but i just.. wanted to know if i was allowed to.

----------------------

the reason i heard that you can't grab opponents blades but you can grab your own is that if you grab an opponents blade, there is usually twisting, gripping hard, or pulling involved... which wears down the weapon. but when holding your own sword, you are more in control and more gentle, thus not nearly as damaging to the blade.

as far as i can tell the national rules do allow it, but it could be different locally. halfswording was used in battles historically, but the fighting would have had gloves on.. ideally chain. i think it would be cool if we were allowed to halfsword.. maybe with the requirement that gloves be worn by the halfsworder, but maybe not.


here are some fun examples:
www.thearma.org/spotlight/RA2001Guild/JeffinGothic1.JPG
www.thearma.org/photos/Harmor/ARMA%20_VAB11.jpg
lamar.colostate.edu/~kenelson/halfswording1.jpg
www.thearma.org/spotlight/sweden03/sweden03-7lg.jpg
www.thearma.org/images/fall02/stck02/uu3.jpg

[Administrator]

This thread gave me a good idea...

CONSIDER IT MOVED!

[Draggeron Ascholie]

the main thing it is bringin up is about the unbreakable armor issue. this is outlining that "anviling" counts as a hit. if you weapon, even the flat is lying on say your leg where it is hangin frmo your belt, it goes through